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IDProjectCategoryView StatusDate SubmittedLast Update
0003036KdenliveEffectspublic2013-03-29 12:052013-03-29 19:41
ReporterSunboy 
Assigned To 
PrioritylowSeverityfeatureReproducibilityN/A
StatusnewResolutionopen 
PlatformOSOS Version
Product Version 
Target VersionFixed in Version 
Summary0003036: Node based effect stack
DescriptionI think the title is speaking for itself ;)

After Kdenlive's effect stack is a wonderful improvement, the next step would be the option to do node-based, so non-linear effect stacking which allows more complex effects and also offers superior usability.
As far as I understand, effects management is done through the MLT framework and so the tool to implement this relatively easily are there. I have not looked neither into the source of kdenlive nor MLT, but definately want to get into this. So if desirable, I would like to take a look what I can do to get something done for this feature ;)
TagsNo tags attached.
Build/Install MethodNot Applicable
Attached Filesjpg file icon concept.jpg [^] (89,915 bytes) 2013-03-29 17:37

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-  Notes
(0009435)
yellow (reporter)
2013-03-29 16:11
edited on: 2013-03-29 16:18

Time to learn GLSL coding via movit library :-)

If you build the movit library and then kdenlive / MLT etc via build script for example, MLT detects movit library and kdenlive already shows parameters and sliders in it's effect stack although they don't function yet and some crash kdenlive. But only to be expected. Assume the heavy refactoring going on at the moment will provide a working solution all this. :-)

A Node GUI would be cool to underlying GLSL effects provided by MLT now, take a look at / play with Shotcut, GLSL effects implemented and usable with realtime playback and said to allow well over 100fps with effects applied. :-)

If nodes were to be implemented I personally don't think it should be done in the isolated way Blender got them, that is the OpenCL version because the effects code in blender is node specific instead of applicable in both a layered way via VSE and a nodal way via compositor nodes.

Consequently it's a mess, color processing code that could be used in both VSE and nodes is not utilized, so some have been 'ported' to the VSE, applying effects in Blender forces constant node calculation and regeneration, which I think they are now trying to circumvent, slowing down what should be a smooth and responsive feedback, but still no chance of realtime playback with effects in place even with proxies.

Nodes and Layers are just GUI's, really they should reference undelying universal effects code. More like Lightworks HLSL approach for effects and custom user effects creation from HLSL code fragment building blocks.

To add new effects we don't really want to have to recompile movit or MLT each time. :-)

(0009436)
Sunboy (reporter)
2013-03-29 17:36
edited on: 2013-03-29 18:51

You are absolutely right :)
Blender's node editor is something completely different as it's not dedicated to video editing and so it is not comfortable to use for those purposes.

From what I have started to read about MLT today, the effect stack of kdenlive is a GUI for dynamically creating mlt_filter instances and linking them in stack order.
According to this, the node editor is nothing more than a GUI for creating and linking filters in a custom order.

My proposal for this:
A node tree should be handled like a new type of an effect group. You can simply add it to the effect stack and the available nodes are simply effects available in kdenlive + transitions/overlays.
In a dedicated node editor you can edit your node tree and the parameters of the selected node are displayed as effect parameters in the effect stack. Look at the attached screenshot.

Advantages:
- The old effect stack system is preserved. If you don't like nodes, you don't have to bother about them.
- Because node trees are handled as effect groups, you can have more than one in your effect stack and also save presets and do drag & drop.
- Already full support for rotoscoping.

(0009437)
yellow (reporter)
2013-03-29 19:41

Sounds great. :-)

- Issue History
Date Modified Username Field Change
2013-03-29 12:05 Sunboy New Issue
2013-03-29 16:11 yellow Note Added: 0009435
2013-03-29 16:12 yellow Note Edited: 0009435 View Revisions
2013-03-29 16:14 yellow Note Edited: 0009435 View Revisions
2013-03-29 16:15 yellow Note Edited: 0009435 View Revisions
2013-03-29 16:15 yellow Note Edited: 0009435 View Revisions
2013-03-29 16:17 yellow Note Edited: 0009435 View Revisions
2013-03-29 16:18 yellow Note Edited: 0009435 View Revisions
2013-03-29 17:36 Sunboy Note Added: 0009436
2013-03-29 17:37 Sunboy File Added: concept.jpg
2013-03-29 17:44 Sunboy Note Edited: 0009436 View Revisions
2013-03-29 18:51 Sunboy Note Edited: 0009436 View Revisions
2013-03-29 19:41 yellow Note Added: 0009437


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